where is his heart?
| Posted On: 04/23/08 10:59:30 PM |
Age 47, NC |
i didn't hear the sermon but i did read the article via the link. many lost DO believe those in the church are extremely judgemental because we ARE. we DON'T show them God's love for them even tho they are sinners because we don't believe that God loves US and we are STILL sinners. when WE don't truly KNOW God's love we cannot GIVE God's love. we too often expect people to clean up BEFORE they can come to God and forget that God is the ONLY ONE who can clean us up. Come as you are - but don't stay as you are is what we SHOULD be preaching. how many of us were saved and immediately became perfect and never sinned? EXACTLY ZERO and anyone who says otherwise is deceiving themselves and lying on top of that - a sin. so yes we SHOULD apologize to those whom we've judged because of their sin. We need God's eyes so we can see them as He sees them not as we see them. All sin is death - there is no sin that is worse than another because when we sin, and yes even the saved sin just ask the apostle paul, we basically throw Jesus's sacrifice back at Him. He found us worthy when we were yet sinners but we can't do the same for others that He also found worthy? shame on us. of course we also need to ask God for forgiveness.
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- Yes, and this also
| Posted On: 04/24/08 08:37:04 AM | | Age 47, MO |
Not only what you said but also consider this. We Christians like to mark ourselves as seperated from the world by our externals; we no longer smoke, we don't drink, we don't cuss, we size others up by our standards, we keep laws of civility and cleanliness, etc. These may be fruit we demonstrate, however, we forgot the mark of a Christian is not the externals but rather the internals. The changed Christian heart follows the Holy Spirit, demonstrates the love of Christ, reaches out with a non judgemental "God is working here" attitude that has faith that God is I AM, and we are saved by grace. John
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- perception
| Posted On: 04/24/08 07:49:47 AM | | Age 42, TN |
I think that alot of times the church is willing to accept people as they are, however, before a person comes to Christ he feels conviction in heart for his sins. That is often percieved as judgement from the church when in reality it is their own feelings of guilt and shame.
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Will God apologize?
| Posted On: 04/23/08 10:37:01 PM |
Age 37, MN |
I think Billy Graham summed it up and put it very poignantly when during one of his sermons he stated, "If God does not judge America, He will need to apologize to Sodom & Gomorrah."
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Has God apologized?
| Posted On: 04/23/08 10:35:03 PM |
Age 37, MN |
I think Billy Graham sums it up and put it very poignantly when during one of his sermons he stated, "If God doesn't judge America, He will need to apologize to Sodom & Gomorrah."
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Wolves in sheeps clothing
| Posted On: 04/23/08 10:19:16 PM |
Age 47, FL |
Ted Haggard...
If a Pastor like that can fool everyone, why not some back water fellow like Mr. "I'm sorry" in Ga.?
Remember, your salvation is dependent on your personal relationship with Jesus and not with your Pastors.
But, understandably, wouldn't be nice to be in a church that runs above reproach!
Pray Hard!
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We're Sorry
| Posted On: 04/23/08 08:36:31 PM |
Age 76, NY |
If there's anything we should really be sorry about is the apathy and complacenccy that Christians have concerning maintaining our rights. Schools founded on Christian principles are now secular, all insinuation of anything Christian is disallowed, removal of the 10 commandments, and the exclusive teaching of evolution in our public schools is a tragedy. We have much to be sorry for and it centers around our ineffectiveness with defending our faith. Today, at my Grandson's school was "Gay Day" with posters all over school grounds eliciting tolerance for gays. He is in trouble for tearing the signs down. There is no effort to have "Christian Day" to show tolerance for Christians. What hypocrisy to have a day celebrating a sinful perverted lifestyle but intolerance for one that is Christly. Christians keep fiddlin, while Rome burns! We have cause to be sorry!! Maybe "sorry" should be changed to "shameful'
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- pround grandparent
| Posted On: 04/24/08 07:53:07 AM | | Age 42, TN |
You should be proud of your grandson to have the boldness to take a stand and actually tear down the signs. Sure he may be in trouble. I am sorry and upset to hear that, however, it is good reason to be in trouble. He took a stand for righteousness.
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Preach Repentance
| Posted On: 04/23/08 04:03:17 PM |
Age 52, OH |
To the writer who says we should be preaching God's love - let's not forget that we are to preach REPENT, FOR THE END IS NEAR. Unless and until a person gets a clear understanding of his position before a Holy God, preaching the love will run the risk of giving him/her false hope. Without repentance, there is no salvation. God does love us - but He has set forth His requirements for individuals to be saved and a true repentance is the first prerequisite. Do we need to be more 'tender' in our approach? Frankly I think we have become TOO tender! We're so afraid we might offend or appear judgemental that we refuse to sound a warning to the unsaved around us. That's not love! Witnessing for Christ is not designed to win you more friends, it is designed to win souls for eternity. We need to be clear that the soul that remains uncleansed from its stain of lies, cheating, theft, adulterous thoughts or actions, homosexuality, murder (including abortion), and all the other sins of a human heart WILL BE DAMNED. Once we sound the warning, only then is it appropriate to share the love. Jonah didn't walk into Ninevah preaching God's love - he preached repentance! And the entire city took heed! Paul didn't mince words, and neither did Peter. Was every individual who heard them saved from the experience? No - but we aren't to worry about the harvest. Our directive is to share the gospel - the WHOLE gospel, not just the love. We need to get our godly backbone in shape and warn those in danger.
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I missed the heresy
| Posted On: 04/23/08 01:05:25 PM |
Age 58, NC |
I am a conservative pentecostal minister and have great difficulty understanding what is heretical about saying these issues are sinful but come to church and find hope and the truth through repentance. The church has missed opportunity after opportunity to witness to the lost because we are so holy we can't talk to a sinner. I was a sinner, but thank God someone came into my sex and drug filled life and had the love and patience to bring me to the truth of salvation. I guess we should strive to be like Jesus who spent his time with the Pharisees picketing the Roman Baths and condemning those who broke the Law. Wake up,Church, while it is still light and open the walls of your holy sanctuary so the fresh breath of the Holy Soirit can waken you out of your unholy legalism and blow the gospel into the community you judge. Let he who is without sin hold the first picket sign.
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It's all about love...
| Posted On: 04/23/08 12:35:19 PM |
Age 33, PA |
I think that what this pastor did in offering a humble public apology was completely in line with Scripture. He did not apologize on 'behalf of God', but on behalf of a judgmental mindset that many 'Christian believers' have in respect to how they view unbelievers, and others in the process of deliverance. As the Word of God states in the New Covenant in Christ Jesus, we are known to be the children of God by our love for one another; God is the only judge. While we are to use discernment in respect to our dealings with others (being equally or unequally yoked), we are supposed to love without judgment with 'no respect of persons'; unlike the hypocritcal Pharisees and Sadducees of Jesus' day. While this website is informative, at times, I find it upsetting that one would deem themselves to be in the position of judgment and continually berate, belittle, and condemn their Brothers and Sisters in Christ based on their opinion. One must be wary as an Old Testament prophet stated to "touch not (God's) anointed and do His prophets no harm." Preach the Gospel in love and so fulfill the will of God in Christ Jesus for all mankind.
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Oh, nuts!
| Posted On: 04/23/08 12:33:54 PM |
Age 55, TX |
I just saw the fine print. They are Baptist or sort of anyway. Men died defending the truth under the name Baptist and at one time ana-Baptist and I am not ashamed of putting in the bold print versus the fine.
Well, again if you aren't convicted of your doctrine and honored to be among the ranks of martyrs and defenders of liberty then take it off completely not use it in the abbreviation or fine print.
Here is one preacher that is Baptist by conviction and honor and pray to be so until death.
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Oh Brother!!!
| Posted On: 04/23/08 12:29:21 PM |
Age 55, TX |
You can believe the Bible or not, but it says what it says. God is the only one who can pass judgment, or at least righteously, and if He said those things and others are sin then they are sin. Saved or lost can either like it or not but I will not apologize for what He said.
My job is just to preach it, not edit it for itching or rebellious ears. If you can't do that, step out of the pulpit and close that Church's doors.
We are in the world but not of it and guess what, our values are going to clash. If you don't believe the Word, don't preach it or attend church. It is that simple.
Frankly, I am ashamed of them and glad they are not a Baptist church. Not sure the Lord is tickled pink either. Now, if they were arrogant and stupid when preaching the truth then the onus is on them to apologize for the attitude and demeanor but not the message.
May God grant us to be like the Marines and be Semper Fi, do or die!!!
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