christian
| Posted On: 03/08/08 12:59:55 PM |
Age 64, IL |
There is a revolution coming. It is a revolt of sincere followers of Jesus against the religion called Christianity. Those who are seeking to do the will of God sense its coming and are being prepared for it by the Spirit. Those who intent on maintaining an appearance of righteousness without the substance of it will be shocked and indignant when it happens. But it will be the work of God, and it will not be stopped. It will bring Chritianity itself to an end, to the everlasting glory of the Father and his Son JESUS CHRIST, and to the very great joy of all who truly love God.
Allen
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What was not said...
| Posted On: 02/19/08 03:32:16 PM |
Age 43, MA |
This is what i replied to Ray's above post, when he published in in his blog, http://raycomfortfood.blogspot.com
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Ray Comfort wrote:
"David, it’s important to speak truthfully about our experiences"
Yes, Ray. As we all know all atheists are just liars, and we lie all the time about everything. :)
Ray Comfort wrote:
"by using the correct terminology..."
If I was using the wrong terminology, then the issue clearly was not that I wasn't truthful, but that I was mistaken. When you say that a person is not being truthful, you are calling them a liar. You clearly called me a liar, Ray. If I "used incorrect terminology", then I was MISTAKEN, not a liar.
By the way -- every particular sect of Christians, from Catholics to Methodists to Wesleyans to Lutherans, to Quakers and Amish, all proclaim that their particular sect is the only "Real Christians (tm)". It's problem that has been going on for about 2000 years now.
Ray Comfort wrote:
"David, if you didn’t know the Lord, then you were a false convert. You were either one or the other. "
I "knew" all of that, and proclaimed it. But I found out after a long education that I was mistaken. You think it's impossible for someone to really believe something, then change, but in reality it happens all the time. Atheists become Christians and Christians become atheists (and some go back and forth several times)all of the time.
Ray Comfort wrote:
"If I had been though your experience, I would be as upset as you."
Ray, you must be imagining things. I don't recall once mentioning that I was upset about anything. How did you come to that conclusion? You must be confusing me with other people you talked to. My conversion from Christian to atheist was slow and painless. Sure -- I met plenty of hypocrites, on both sides of the fence. But it was not a process that involved a lot of grief or guilt. It was sort of a slow learning process that ended in liberation.
Ray comfort wrote:
"So, be careful when you dine with atheists, because the sweet dishes they serve up contain undetected poison that will find its way into your very heart."
Oh, really? Well, I guess that's because me and all the other atheists out there are all really just pawns of the devil, and we are all liars who can never tell the truth about anything, and we're all just trying to poison all of your minds, before we feast on your flesh and drink your blood in our secret satanic cannibal rituals! :)
Really Ray, Do you really think you will ever make any headway, with you always calling me and other atheists liars, right to our faces, and pretending to know everything that we think? If I was always calling you a liar, or questioned your sanity or education, you'd be complaining left and right.
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- Lying to Oneself
| Posted On: 03/08/08 09:57:44 PM | | Age 33, OK |
Former Christian/Atheist, I was recently watching a show my family was watching a gameshow about telling truth for money. They had this one young woman who had been married for a few years. Her dad,mom,and sister were there along with her husband. For money she agreed to truthfully admit that she knew a secret her dad did not tell her mom,she married her husband although she loved another man, she would have prefered to marry her ex-boyfriend,and she had commited adultery against her husband. All this she told truthfully for the money, but when they asked her do you think you are a good person she answered yes. The lie detector they had strapped to her beeped that was wrong. She was lying to herself. Inside her consciense knew she was not a good person she was sinful,dishonest towards others and her own flesh. Atheists may speak the truth in some instances but inside they are lying to themselves their own souls their own conditions that there is a God and they need a way back to him.A mirror to their own soul that it is filthy and black. Christians admit honestly ours is black and filthy and truthfully needs cleaning.
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- Arrogance...
| Posted On: 03/24/08 01:26:15 PM | | Age 43, MA |
Someone wrote:
"Atheists may speak the truth in some instances but inside they are lying to themselves their own souls their own conditions that there is a God and they need a way back to him.A mirror to their own soul that it is filthy and black. Christians admit honestly ours is black and filthy and truthfully needs cleaning."
Anyone who presumes to know what other people think are just arrogant and have nothing productive to say. To presume that you know that we atheists lie to ourselves is nothing more than an empty statement -- a pre-programmed, knee-jerk reaction. It's what Christians tell former believers or unbelievers to blow them off so that they don't have to actually come up with a substantive response.
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What was not said...
| Posted On: 02/19/08 03:27:58 PM |
Age 43, MA |
I am David W. Irish, and the original letter I wrote was on Ray's blog. I was responding to a question that Ray Posted.
What is not said is my response to his response which was posted here.
Here is what I wrote in response to Ray's post:
Ray Comfort wrote:
"David, it’s important to speak truthfully about our experiences"
Yes, Ray. As we all know all atheists are just liars, and we lie all the time about everything. :)
Ray Comfort wrote:
"by using the correct terminology. Rather than saying “When I was a Christian,” you should say “When I professed to be a Christian,” or, to be biblically sound, “When I was a false convert.” Your spurious experience isn’t surprising, because you believe that being a Christian is “a mindset, a philosophy, a way of living.” That’s not the definition of a Christian. I had those things in my surfing days. Rather, a Christian is someone who knows the Lord (see John 17:3)."
If I was using the wrong terminology, then the issue clearly was not that I wasn't truthful, but that I was mistaken. When you say that a person is not being truthful, you are calling them a liar. You clearly called me a liar, Ray. If I "used incorrect terminology", then I was MISTAKEN, not a liar.
By the way -- every particular sect of Christians, from Catholics to Methodists to Wesleyans to Lutherans, to Quakers and Amish, all proclaim that their particular sect is the only "Real Christians (tm)". It's problem that has been going on for about 2000 years now.
Ray Comfort wrote:
"David, if you respond to me by saying that you were a genuine Christian, then you are admitting that you knew the Lord, that Jesus rose from the dead, and Christianity is therefore true. If you didn’t know the Lord, then you were a false convert. You were either one or the other. "
I "knew" all of that, and proclaimed it. But I found out after a long education that I was mistaken. You think it's impossible for someone to really believe something, then change, but in reality it happens all the time. Atheists become Christians and Christians become atheists (and some go back and forth several times)all of the time.
Ray Comfort wrote:
"If I had been though your experience, I would be as upset as you."
Ray, you must be imagining things. I don't recall once mentioning that I was upset about anything. How did you come to that conclusion? You must be confusing me with other people you talked to. My conversion from Christian to atheist was slow and painless. Sure -- I met plenty of hypocrites, on both sides of the fence. But it was not a process that involved a lot of grief or guilt. It was sort of a slow learning process that ended in liberation.
Ray comfort wrote:
"Remember that Judas ended up hanging himself. So, be careful when you dine with atheists, because the sweet dishes they serve up contain undetected poison that will find its way into your very heart. They will feed you tasty Bible verses out of contact, misquotes, and half-truths. The devil will give you enough rope to hang yourself. I would hate that to happen to you. Thanks for reading this."
Oh, really? Well, I guess that's because me and all the other atheists out there are all really just pawns of the devil, and we are all liars who can never tell the truth about anything, and we're all just trying to poison all of your minds, before we feast on your flesh and drink your blood in our secret satanic cannibal rituals! :)
Really Ray, Do you really think you will ever make any headway, with you always calling me and other atheists liars, right to our faces, and pretending to know everything that we think? If I was always calling you a liar, or questioned your sanity or education, you'd be complaining left and right.
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Basically, I can't stand hearing people tell me that it was impossible for me to have been "a real Christian" and give it up. It presumes that they know more about my mind than I do. It's arrogant.
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Head Knowledge and Heart Knowledge
| Posted On: 02/06/08 04:13:30 PM |
Age 33, OK |
Head Knowledge
Many know scriptures,even copying them using them in quotes in books in conversation not knowing they came from the word of God. Your heart knowing scripture is when it reaches right unto your soul speaking to You and you know its for you its a mirror unto your being.
King David said I will hide your word in my heart that I may not sin against you.
Some scholars, thinkers,philosphers know scriptures.
But do they walk it do they love it do they live it. What is that our lord said to those who knowingly sin against others depart from me worker of iniquity I knew you not.
Satan knew scriptures the demons recognized Christ. Having a head knowledge does not mean having a heart knowledge.
When something is in your heart you are feverent about it,passionate about it, you get riled up to defend it,to live for it, to die for it if God wills it.
You know that you know. A mother knows when her child is sick or hurt, A mother knows when they are telling a lie unto her. It is in her heart that understanding that bond.
Having a heart knowledge of faith in Christ is like.You are a starving man and it is the water on a hot sandy desert.You would not survive without it.
Minds can be changed while true feelings in your heart cannot.
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Being a Christian is NOT a mind set
| Posted On: 02/05/08 04:26:58 PM |
Age 57, MN |
Kudos RAY,
RIGHT on.
NO one was a CHRISTIAN, it doesnt work that way, and Ray, made sure to make that clear, you are or you AINT!.
For the feedback, its sad, to see such lack of wisdom, who read RAYS article.
THIS seems to be the WISDOM, I mean LACK of WISDOM, from most out there who (CLAIM) to be saved.
THESE writers, of the feedback, need to stay in the word more, they sound VERY much like the world, in the way they gave feedback to RAYS article.
NOTHING RAY said, NEEDED CORRECTING. STOP being ASLEEP at the WHEEL!
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The heart of David I.
| Posted On: 02/05/08 01:28:44 PM |
Age 55, MN |
I tend to agree with "Age 28, of GA." Although we as readers don't know the heart of David, Ray also chose not to reveal everything that the letter said. I would like to trust that Ray took into consideration the entire context of the letter and responded accordingly. I think you have a point, however, in that there are people out there who have very tender hearts and tend to fall apart when confronted. I think in this case because we don't know everything David I wrote, we need to trust Ray's discretion in this.
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Re: cleaning up the mess
| Posted On: 02/05/08 01:24:01 PM |
Age 32, TX |
hi Steve,
You say that what God desires most is compassion, but if you look in the Bible, you'll find that the Bible actually says that God desires obedience most. You see, if someone has a crisis of faith, they need to repent, because they are doubting God, which is calling him a liar, which is a terrible sin. They need gentle but firm instruction that points them to the truth of God's word. A man-centered Gospel says that God did everything for man, even died on the Christ solely for the sake of man -- in effect putting man at the center of the universe (humanism - idolatry). In fact, the Bible states that God does everything primarily for His glory, including demonstrating His kindness toward us by sending His Son to earth to redeem mankind from sin and their justly deserved fate of hell. It is a just punishment as we have sinned against an infinitely holy and righteous God who gave us all that we have, all the good things that we have, and yet we rebelliously shake our fists in His face. God's longsuffering lasts until the person's life is over, at which time, they will have to give an account of the One who is the just Judge of all the earth. Please be careful that in your compassion for others that you don't make Man an idol, but rather do the most loving thing: tell them the truth about their state before a righteous and holy God who is angry with the wicked every day, and their great need for repentance and faith in Christ.
God bless,
Matt
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- I changed my mind..
| Posted On: 02/06/08 02:58:19 AM | | Age 44, ENGLAND |
Understand where you are coming from...What changed my mind and approach to this subject though was the attempted suicide of a friend (grown up mother) when treatede in just such a way. Life is very complicated sometimes and so are people. She found her way through but is took a lot of love and care and the undoing of those who felt that such an approach as above would work. Steve
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Christian Mindset
| Posted On: 02/05/08 09:50:16 AM |
Age 61, OH |
Dear Brother Ray,
I liked your article in principle.But there is a way that you state things that could be misunderstood. Coming to believe in Christ and repenting of personal sin is the starting point in the long process of sanctification. We can make no progress without the indwelling Holy Spirit. You said that Christianity is not a philosophy or a mind set. But it is if guided by the spirit. The scripture talks about renewing the mind and not being taken captive by hollow nonchristian philosophy. It is God's truth revealed in scripture that must be our total belief system, mind set or philosophy. That is why you must be careful in using these words.
I have one more comment regarding the written or spoken word. I am sure Jesus used mostly compassionate words and language, but he did use strong language at times. The point is that he spoke truth and there was an immediate division from his audience. At times it evoked strong feelings and rage. It was not Jesus who caused this but the sin in the heart of the hearer. If Jesus was misunderstood we will be the same.
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cleaning up the mess
| Posted On: 02/04/08 02:29:35 PM |
Age 44, ENGLAND |
Ray you wrote
The devil will give you enough rope to hang yourself. I would hate that to happen to you. Thanks for reading this.
I'm certain you feel very clever for writing this, I though have had to clear up the mess that such comments as this leave behind as people deal with crisis of faith. This sort of sarcastic comment makes me so angry, you lack what God desires most , compassion. You write such comments but you do not have to pick up the pieces.
Steve
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- compassion?
| Posted On: 02/12/08 04:43:55 PM | | Age 19, LA |
I often times hear Christians and/or professing Christians say to someone who has spent his or her life for the lost that that person lacks compassion. Compassion isn't being so soft that you comfort a person into hell. Compassion is when concern for the lost weigh on your mind so much that you leave a puddle of tears on the ground as you pray. Compassion is going out of your way to reach out to, win, consolidate, disciple, and send everyone that God brings in your way. Compassion is when you give your whole life for the Gospel. I'm no theologian, but a person can't say that they have compassion and not have ever wept for the lost.
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- Sarcastic Commnet?
| Posted On: 02/06/08 12:22:40 AM | | Age 52, CA |
Steve: Are you cleverly employing obfuscation here? I applaud your ability to pull three sentences from a seven sentence paragraph and misapply it! You, sir, clearly did not comprehend the article as written. //Mr Comfort is merely stating it doubtful that Irish was, in fact, Christian. One is a Christian or one is not. Pieces for man to pick up: Zero. God can, does and will clean up the mess one makes of one's life when one comes to the saving cross of my Lord and Redeemer Jesus. Do you know Jesus, Steve? If not, I pray you contact Comfort. Blessings, Herb
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- Right way round?
| Posted On: 02/07/08 06:35:12 AM | | Age 44, ENGLAND |
Do I know our Lord? I think the more important question to ask is does he know us? In the gospels he sent people away at judgement time because he says he never knew them not vice versa. This should cause us to pause for thought... It does me
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- He wasn't harsh
| Posted On: 02/05/08 12:01:45 PM | | Age 28, GA |
The individual in question wasn't coming to Ray, wringing his hands with indecision or doubt. He made it clear that it really didn't matter whether the Bible is God's inspired word or not. He made up his mind. I don't think Ray answered very harshly. When dealing with hardline atheists/evolutionists/etc, you typically can't use your kid gloves.
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