feminine women
| Posted On: 01/17/08 06:05:49 PM |
Age 46, MI |
The call to be holy is for all of God's people. (Romans 12:1, Ephesians 1:4)
Steve Camp's post is not against women at all, but rather a particular call to men to be bold for the sake of the Lord Jesus Christ, rather than cowaring in the cultural norm of getting along with everyone, (including an overpowering wife).
Ladies, relax. God has called us to be His women - bold and feminine. Stop playing at 'Eve in the garden' and let the men be men! Pray for your men, encourage them in the Lord and thank Him for making you a woman!
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Feminization = weak??
| Posted On: 01/17/08 03:48:26 PM |
Age 31, IN |
Feminization is defined as "the acquisition of female characteristics by a male." Two questions: (1) Why on earth does Steve Camp (and CWN) think that being passive, soft, non-confrontational, fearful, and approval-seeking are specifically female characteristics; and (2) Why on earth does Steve Camp (and CWN) believe that only *men* are needed to be "strong in the Lord" and all that? Why doesn't he consult Scripture about which genders are commanded to speak the truth in love, confront evil, stand up for God rather than seek the approval of others? I'm pretty sure Scripture doesn't give these injunctions only to half of God's servants. It's too bad that CWN perpetuates the insidious, destructive heresy that assigns women the role of passive, soft, fearful do-nothings, while looking only for men to be "active" for God. It's a heresy one would think even a casual acquaintance with Scripture would make easily recognizable... Or am I misunderstanding what seem to be fairly plain commitments of this article?
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- RUTH
| Posted On: 01/17/08 09:56:15 PM | | Age 64, OH |
Read the book of Ruth and see how God would have a woman act. I am a man and Ruth is one of my heroes. I have not seen one woman who would measure up to her in this nation that I have met. God sent Naomi into Moab to get Ruth and bring her to Himself. Look at how Ruth talks to men. When addressing Boaz she calls herself his servant. But look at the speech she gives Naomi in Ch 1: 16 But Ruth replied, "Don't urge me to leave you or to turn back from you. Where you go I will go, and where you stay I will stay. Your people will be my people and your God my God. 17 Where you die I will die, and there I will be buried. May the LORD deal with me, be it ever so severely, if anything but death separates you and me." 18 When Naomi realized that Ruth was determined to go with her, she stopped urging her.-- Ruth did not confront men and even other women. But she was certainly brave, loyal, and everything I would want in a woman. One of the pillars of the Temple was named Boaz and Boaz jumped at the chance to marry Ruth. I have thought I would never marry again but if i met a Ruth I would jump at the chance and even fight for a chance to marry one like Ruth. I have never met even one women who is close to having all of her qualities. I would rather have Ruth on my side than almost any man I have met. One might call her a female tiger.But she was very, very feminine. Lou
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RE feminine vs. feminist
| Posted On: 01/17/08 02:51:48 PM |
Age 36, WI |
That is very wise, coming from one so young! Stay strong in the Lord! God bless.
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Sissification vs Feminization vs Compromise and Laziness???
| Posted On: 01/17/08 12:51:06 PM |
Age 00, NY |
Okay, maybe "Feminization" is not the proper word. I would say "the Sissification of the Evangelical Man" today rather than the "Feminization of the Evangelical Man". Forgive me, I take offense to the word "feminization" being a woman. It seems to blame women for this wimpy wine. Lol,lol! Forgive I can't stop laughing.
Women are good. Men are good. So, this is no feminist diatribe. I'm no feminist. I'm a bible believing Christian Woman. But it would be nice if Christian men praise women more. God loves women. When ever I here words like "feminized gospel" I here christian men blaming all the problems of the Church today on women. And not either on wimpy lazy compromised men or compromised Christian leaders, all the blame falls on women. Yet, both women and men share equally in the good or bad in the Church of Christ today. Although I see very little good these days. All I here is lots of complaining.
We need to reach out for lost souls(evangelism and prayer) and rebuild the walls of the Church. No matter how small the body may be now. The foundation is the Lords.
God Bless
Dannygirl
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- MEN AND WOMEN
| Posted On: 01/17/08 09:39:14 PM | | Age 64, OH |
Maybe you offend too easy. I did not hear Steve blame or criticize a woman one time in this article. He put ALL THE BLAME ON MEN. So what do you want. I think women are great but i do not like it when men act like women. For a woman to act like a woman should is to her glory but for a man to act the same is an abomination. Lou
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- Women
| Posted On: 01/17/08 09:35:10 PM | | Age 64, OH |
I did not hear Steve criticize women once here.
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- Not offensive?
| Posted On: 01/19/08 12:14:46 AM | | Age 31, IN |
To those who don't understand why some take offense at Steve Camp's article, I'd like to offer the following explanation. Steve lists a number of characteristics - things like being cowardly, fearful, looking for human rather than Godly approval, weak, passive, non-confrontational. He argues that these characteristics are exceedingly negative - indeed, they are opposed to faith, true doctrine, Biblical injunctions, proper living for God, and truth; they represent a dangerous and anti-Biblical element of "postmodern evangelicalism," according to Steve. And then he both explicitly and implicitly identifies these anti-Christian characteristics as being *feminine*. So, how is that NOT offensive (not to mention unbiblical)? If it needs to be made even clearer, just imagine an analogous article lamenting the "Negro-ification" of the Evangelical Christian," identifying the former with a list of characteristics that violate Biblical commands to confrontatively and boldly speak the truth in love, etc.
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- MEN AND WOMEN
| Posted On: 01/21/08 07:14:10 PM | | Age 64, OH |
I think you need to read the article with more care. Steve did not say what you said he said. Steve said that men who were not willing to CONFRONT the error in the church were feminine. He did NOT say it was feminine to be in error. If Steve had addressed a large portion of the women in this nation as cowards, some would argue that he would have had reason. It seems to me that many women are being cowardly when they say they want to compete on a equal basis with men but are the first to complain when men bully them. Like the woman golfer who wanted to play with the men; but when a man tried to join the woman tour it was not allowed. If women wanted to compete on an equal basis with men in sports it would not be a thing of beauty and would not glorify God. God created men and women different. If they put women and men basketball together there would be mighty few women and probably none who could make the pro teams. The women have a right to compete separately; but so do the men. Women either want to be treated as the weaker vessel or NOT. They can not have it both ways. Some want to call men names and even swear at them, but if the man would strike the woman like the man she is acting like, she would be the 1st to call him a woman abuser. Was she not being a man abuser when she yelled and screamed at the man. I think women are a lovely creation of God when they act like women. Ruth is one of my HEROES. But I see few like Ruth. When a women tries to act like a man she makes a mighty poor man as does a man when he tries to be a woman. Lou
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- Try it this way
| Posted On: 01/20/08 02:15:07 PM | | Age 28, TX |
Ever notice that when a male starts behaving cowardly, he is exhorted to "man up"? I would give further examples of how a male is described when he lacks the psychological qualities of manhood, but most of them refer to his lacking physical manhood...Or how about "mama's boy"? Ever hear that one? There's nothing wrong with calling a fellow "feminized" who refuses to behave like a man. Most males who try to act like a woman invariably demonstrate the negative versions of our positive traits.--Mrs. Pilgrim
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Exactly right!
| Posted On: 01/17/08 12:39:35 PM |
Age 47, MO |
Here is another quote from Luther: "If I profess with the loudest voice and clearest exposition every portion of the Word of God except precisely that little point which the world and the devil are at that moment attacking, I am not confessing Christ, however boldly I may be professing Him. Where the battle rages, there the loyalty of the soldier is proved; and to be steady on all the battle front besides, is mere flight and disgrace if he flinches at that point." -John
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- Exactly Right!
| Posted On: 01/18/08 10:56:16 PM | | Age 52, TN |
<b>John</b>
Tremendous quote from Luther. Thank you dear brother. Oh for men of God like this again!
Steve
2 Tim. 2:15
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Feminization
| Posted On: 01/17/08 11:28:36 AM |
Age 59, SC |
The only person idiotic enough to equate femininity with being weak and lacking is someone who has never had to undergo a 30-hour labor.
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- Labor Pains
| Posted On: 01/17/08 09:48:08 PM | | Age 59, CANADA |
I think you might of missed what He was trying to get accross.
Question; why do women have labor pain?
God Bless
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The Feminization of evangelical men...
| Posted On: 01/17/08 11:23:33 AM |
Age 44, KY |
Great article Steve, but are you not familiar with Isaiah 3: 1-12?
1 For behold, the Lord, the LORD of hosts, Takes away from Jerusalem and from Judah The stock and the store, The whole supply of bread and the whole supply of water; 2 The mighty man and the man of war, The judge and the prophet, And the diviner and the elder; 3 The captain of fifty and the honorable man, The counselor and the skillful artisan, And the expert enchanter. 4 “ I will give children to be their princes, And babes shall rule over them. 5 The people will be oppressed, Every one by another and every one by his neighbor; The child will be insolent toward the elder, And the base toward the honorable.” 6 When a man takes hold of his brother In the house of his father, saying, “ You have clothing; You be our ruler, And let these ruins be under your power,”[a]
7 In that day he will protest, saying, “ I cannot cure your ills, For in my house is neither food nor clothing; Do not make me a ruler of the people.” 8 For Jerusalem stumbled, And Judah is fallen, Because their tongue and their doings Are against the LORD, To provoke the eyes of His glory. 9 The look on their countenance witnesses against them, And they declare their sin as Sodom; They do not hide it. Woe to their soul! For they have brought evil upon themselves. 10 “ Say to the righteous that it shall be well with them, For they shall eat the fruit of their doings. 11 Woe to the wicked! It shall be ill with him, For the reward of his hands shall be given him. 12 As for My people, children are their oppressors, And women rule over them. O My people! Those who lead you cause you to err, And destroy the way of your paths.”
Can you see the similarity to what is going on around the world today as to what Isaiah was talking about above? While I applaud your concern, and agree with you totally, I don't think we will do much halt this "Feminization" of not only evangelicals but this country, and most western countries. We here, that read and write these blogs, are but a very small minority of the Christian faith, and while we might scream it to the tops of our lungs and write brilliant articles about the problems, the die appears to be set for the world and most of those who call themselves Christians, for most live with one leg firmly planted in the world and one toe dipped in Christianity!
Just my 2 cents worth... Mark
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Feminine vs. Feminist
| Posted On: 01/17/08 10:57:56 AM |
Age 19, MN |
I think Steve Camp's point (for those who are commenting that he seems to be equating feminity with the a failure to stand up for the gospel) is that there is a feminist view that is moving into the church and abroad (actually, probably for awhile) that is taking an "emotions-over-truth" approach to Scripture. So, I don't think he is putting women down. He is just commenting that men need to stand up for truth in love (esp. husbands and dads since they are the head of the family). Incidentally, we are to speak the truth in love (read 1 Cor. 13 and read what love IS!) but that being said, one must not be without the other. Merely speaking the truth (and dropping love) only hurts and chases people away. Dropping the truth eliminates love altogether (because love rejoices in the truth). You must have both, without compromise.
Have a great day and God Bless!
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- feminization?
| Posted On: 01/17/08 12:40:09 PM | | Age 31, IL |
You make an interesting point, but if the article is referring to "feminist" arguments, philosophies or methods, the word "feminized" is used incorrectly. This word generally refers to having feminine qualities, not to holding "feminist" views. (The Oxford English dictionary defines "feminize" as "1. a. trans. To make feminine or womanish; to give a feminine cast to (a description). b. intr. To become or grow feminine. 2. trans. Biol. To induce female sexual characteristics in.")
And the approach criticized in the article -- using a "velvet sword," or being unwilling to defend the truth because you would rather focus on emotions and be nice and non-confrontational -- is not the standard feminist approach. The article would offer a stronger argument by addressing the issue without using the word "feminized" to describe those who don't defend the Gospel. If a woman accepts an unbiblical statement so that she won't offend someone, it would be silly to tell her she's "feminized" -- she's incorrect, and the same is true for a man.
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- MEN AND WOMEN
| Posted On: 01/17/08 09:27:30 PM | | Age 64, OH |
Steve did not say that these men were accepting a watered down gospel but not willing to confront the lies or false gospel. That would be being feminine would it not. A women is to be a more gentle and kind spirit and not to confront a man in a non gentle way. It is to the womans glory to behave this way but it is not to the glory of a man. Lou
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Losing our ability to tell it like it is
| Posted On: 01/17/08 10:15:09 AM |
Age 40, IL |
while I agree with you 100% that we have lost true leaders who did not compromise the Gospel for fear of "offending" anybody, I take umbrage with the trend of labeling anything that is weak or nice or anything else "feminine". The message you are sending to the children of the church is that anything and everything male is good, anything that is less than male is feminine and therefore bad.
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- Designed to be...
| Posted On: 01/18/08 08:40:25 AM | | Age 47, MO |
Why would you possibly think male good, female bad? How about male male, and female female. Isn't that the point Steve is making? Here's an excerpt from a letter I wrote: "Christ came to drive a wedge and to separate- to create absolutes; truths that are cherished. (Another saying: Men create or separate, Women incubate. Men are straight line, women are circular.)" Without volgar conotations let me also say that men ejaculate (put forth, postulate, etc), women incubate (nurture, protect, etc). It is by design that we are what we are, Steve is only saying to live up to our God given design and abilities. John
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I agree
| Posted On: 01/17/08 10:13:58 AM |
Age 56, AR |
This week the Lord has been laying on my heart the message of Jude. We are called to love, but we are likewise called to contend for the faith.
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