Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/17/07 05:59:28 PM |
Age 21, MO |
Why was this letter not sent personally instead of put out in the public square? If you email/mailed/called London and talked to him about this first? Why use the soapbox to taint your message instead of doing things personally first? I am 100% O.K. with you doing this if you did it personally first but did you? Why the slandering of someone?
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Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/13/07 03:36:50 PM |
Age 30, MN |
Ingrid you should fear being unloving becauese you are in direct disobedience of Jesus whosaid love EVERYONE as I have loved you.
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Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/12/07 06:53:07 AM |
Age 45, PA |
Hey, Dobson is building a kingdom and he needs subjects and money, just like all the other(man)kingdom builders. If it's big it must be of God, reason would tell you.
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Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/09/07 07:55:39 PM |
Age 49, IL |
"Rupert Murdoch...one of the biggest porn producers..."
That said, then if it is wrong for a Christian pastor to mix with him, then it is wrong for any Christian to ever appear on or even watch FOX News (owned by Murdoch), buy a Bible printed by Zondervan (part of Harper/Collins, owned by Murdoch), or work in or shop at Family Christian Stores (also owned by Murdoch).
BTW, that means Ray Comfort, Alex McFarland, Josh McDowell and John Piper must all be dismissed as contributors to Christian Worldview Network; since all have been published by Murdoch's NewsCorp owned Zondervan. Working on the same forum as these tainted individuals makes you just as guilty of participating in Murdoch's sins as they are.
Starting to see the absurdity here?
Today's multi-corporation conglomerates can make things rather messy when it comes to separating ourselves from the world...
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- Re: Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/11/07 12:56:21 PM | | Age 27, REPUBLIC OF KOREA |
There is a huge difference from conducting business with and unconverted sinner to get a book published and inviting a lost sinner to come speak at a church about the Christian faith! We are told to be in the world not of the world. There is nothing wrong with going on to Fox News and doing an interview. But there is everything wrong when we are bringing men who profit off of sin and who wish to distort the historical biblical Gospel message of Christ dieing for the sins of his enemies. All for the glory of God.
Thank you Ingrid for standing up and defending truth in a time where biblical truth and knowlegde is really lacking among the Church.
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- Re: Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/10/07 01:56:35 PM | | Age 39, MO |
The difference between Ray Comfort, John Piper, etc. having their books in these places, and Mr. London and others participating in Schuller's conference, is just that...They are participating, not warning against it. Comfort and others are condeming schuller's kind of gospel. They are standing against these folks when they speak or write their books. Will Mr. London be speaking out against schuller's man-made gospel? Will Erwin Mcmanus, Kay Warren and the others be warning you about the new age teachings and leanings of schuller? Ray Comfort would, at the same time he would be preaching the One and only Gospel.
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Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/09/07 05:32:20 PM |
Age 64, TN |
Ingrid - Thank you for responding to this issue as you have. I admire you for speaking out when you see reason for alarm. It is disheartening how frequently I am met with an "don't make such a big deal out of this" attitude when I see something happening that is theologically questionable. Someone else who wrote feedback said it well when he/she said that Christians seem more afraid of appearing to be "unloving" than they are of offending God. Too often the response is, "but look how much good so and so is doing for God" without an understanding that end results don't justify wrong means. Stay strong.
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Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/09/07 10:20:29 AM |
Age 47, MO |
Ingrid, outstanding! Thanks for your work, be sure to report back any response. John
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Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/09/07 08:28:04 AM |
Age 48, IL |
Ingrid:
Praise God for your firm stance, and your boldness to speak out. It is becoming quite clear the scriptures are being played out before our very eyes,- the falling away from saving faith, the astronomical rise in false teachings, no tolerance for sound doctrine,- is it any wonder our Lord said, "However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?" {Luke 18:8}
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Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/09/07 07:17:40 AM |
Age 38, CA |
Ingrid...let's see what some of these speakers actually say at the event, and not jump the gun and begin condemning them too soon. I would speak there if asked, and this is exactly what I'd say:
"It’s time for the nation to turn back to absolute truth and away from relativism—back to Christ and away from the broad road that leads to destruction. We must repent, ask for forgiveness, and seek restoration. We should not apologize for preaching God’s Word, redefine what He meant, or back down from conflict. We are in the midst of a spiritual battle. We will be hated for following Christ, mocked for believing in truth, and challenged for promoting righteousness. We are called to deny ourselves, pick up our cross, and follow Him. Clearly, the day of the passive church is over. We must lovingly preach righteousness in our pulpits again: “Righteousness exalts a nation, but sin is a reproach to any people” (Proverbs 14:34). Richard Owen Roberts said it well, “The Lord has been so deeply grieved by the refusal of the church to faithfully proclaim the whole counsel of His Word in the power of the Holy Spirit that He has largely withdrawn from the church and left her to her own devices.” Roberts continues, “The heart cry of God is most certainly, ‘Return to Me, and I will return to you’ (Malachi 3:7). ”
S. Idleman
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Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/08/07 06:45:17 PM |
Age 50, MN |
I haven't read Mr. London's statement. However what was Paul doing at Mars Hill and why did he go there?
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- Re: Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/09/07 08:57:04 AM | | Age 49, WI |
Um, are you calling Robert Schuller and friends pagans? They may not appreciate that. I have read his statement that London is sending out and it is without Scriptural basis. As for those London refers to as having "different" views, that would include his ever-gracious host, Dr. Schuller, who has been spreading a false gospel for decades. There is no "different" gospel. The rest are the doctrines of anti-christ and H.B. London knows it.
Here's London's statement below. Interesting that he says talks about a recommitment to the "gospel of the cross" when his host says the gospel of the cross is about rescuing our self-esteem? First you have to agree on what the "gospel of the cross" actually is!
STATEMENT from H.B. London
Thank you for your concern about my participation in the Rethink conference taking place at the Crystal Cathedral in January.
Since coming to Focus on the Family over 16 years ago, my calling and my passion has been to minister to those who minister, and to encourage the spiritual renewal and restoration of pastors in any way I can. At times I have been asked to speak at events where every speaker may not present the same message or perspective. Such may be the case at the upcoming conference. But you can be assured that the message I deliver will not be compromised in any way. As always my goal will be to challenge pastors and Christian leaders to live a life of deeper and greater faith, while stressing the importance of building safeguards into our lives and marriages.
I do understand that not all Christian leaders agree that the opportunity to influence hundreds of pastors with the message of moral purity and a recommitment to the gospel of the cross justifies being part of an event where other voices that I may not fully agree with can also be heard. That is a decision that needs to be made with much prayer and Christian council. I view every invitation I receive as a possible calling form God to minister to those in need, so I try to the best of my ability, to discern which opportunities God would have me accept.
Also, I believe that the promotional materials for the Rethink Conference make it clear that the speakers will represent a variety of disciplines and viewpoints. The goal is not to "rethink" the message of the gospel, but to "rethink" the methods we use to communicate the gospel in a constantly changing world. The organizers also hope to challenge the way that pastors think about ministry as it relates to culture, social change and world events. It's my prayer that God will use my voice to encourage those in attendance to stay rooted in their first love, to never compromise their integrity, and to never stray from the message of going into all the world to preach the gospel.
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- Re: Re: Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/09/07 03:02:56 PM | | Age 61, MO |
Here is part of London's message: "The goal is not to "rethink" the message of the gospel, but to "rethink" the methods we use to communicate the gospel in a constantly changing world. The organizers also hope to challenge the way that pastors think about ministry as it relates to culture, social change and world events." The whole idea that man has the audacity to think he can have a better way of drawing people to Christ is heresy in and of itself. The Holy Spirit does the drawing. He may use people with His "thoughts," but all the clever marketing techniques developed by man will be of no avail unless the Spirit comes first. It is almost like saying: "Let us gang up on the Holy Spirit and squeeze more people through the straight gate." "We are going to have a Holy Spirit Revival, whether the Holy Spirit shows up or not." George Cancilla
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- Re: Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/08/07 09:49:24 PM | | Age 34, TX |
Okay, so what exactly do you mean by your question, why the Apostle Paul, a missionary, went to a pagan city filled with unbelievers? Am I wrong to assume that you are somehow equating Robert Schuller's conference, the speakers and all the attendees with the pagans at Mars Hill who need evangelizing (that may be true), or that you are saying that Paul's missionary journey is somehow comparable to this gentleman Mr. London speaking at the Rethink Conference?
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- Re: Re: Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/12/07 08:41:15 AM | | Age 50, MN |
The individuals Paul wished to engage and be a part of on Mars Hill were the intellectual thinkers of the day - men who were seeking god, albeit in a limited or you could even say a misguided way. So are there not similarities and shouldn't London use the same principle as Paul? //I think Ingrid can only be happy when she is tearing apart a Christian brother. Sorry to be so cynical, but show me any evidence to the contrary.
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- Re: Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/08/07 09:30:08 PM | | Age 61, MO |
Paul went to Mars Hill to inform the Athenians about the new doctrine of a crucified Christ: "And they took him (Paul), and brought him unto Areopagus (Mars Hill), saying, May we know what this new doctrine, whereof thou speakest, is?" (Acts 17:19). If you are trying to insinuate that Mr. London, or any of the other speakers at this conference could be like Paul, then you are really creating a stretch. But wouldn't it be wonderful if Mr. London were to set the rest of them straight? George Cancilla
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Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/08/07 04:53:08 PM |
Age 61, MO |
Approximately 10 years ago, my wife and I supported Focus on the Family. We were homeschooling our daughter, and found the Adventures in Odyssey stories to be something we could let our daughter hear. But we soon began to see that these stories were just morality plays were good triumphs over evil. They were not grounded in Christ. It would have seemed that Dobson would have promoted home schooling, but he was more interested in fixing the public schools. I am not sure exactly when we broke off from Focus on the Family, but it came soon after we read Dobson's book about teens and dating. It became clear that Dobson did not have a handle on Biblical precepts; but then He never promoted himself as a theologian. It also became clear that he was about big business with the word "family" being a powerful drawing card. I am not surprised that Focus would see this Schuller conference as a big promotional tool for the enhancement of the Focus enterprise. The only way that good will have any enduring triumph over evil is through Jesus Christ. This conference may produce small short term gains, but will result in long term disaster for those who fall for its rhetoric. George Cancilla
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- Re: Re: An Open Letter to Focus on the Family's H.B. London
| Posted On: 11/09/07 08:23:33 AM | | Age 53, OH |
It saddens me to hear of your experience with Focus on the Family. Our experience has always been just the opposite. We sent our son to Christian schools after being encouraged by Dr. Dobson to consider that option. At the time, Dr Dobson also gave positive reasons for home-schooling but there were not as many curricula available back then. Dr Dobson has tried to improve the public schools because he has such a burden for the children of this country and for the country and he realizes how much damage secular humanism can do to both in the long run. He also recognizes that not all parents can afford Christian schools and not all parents are equipped to home school - they are stuck with public schools so of course he is going to try to improve the public schools. I STILL enjoy listening to Adventures in Odyssey. I thank God often for Dr Dobson's willingness to follow God's leading in the Focus ministry. I can not explain why H B London would go to that conference, but I am willing to wait and find out if there is an explanation. I am glad God does not squash me every time I make a mistake.
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