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Quit Inviting People to Church
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 03:15:54 PM Age 19, MN
I think Mr. Baumann has a very valid point. I am left wondering, however, whether he disapproves of such attractions as plays, productions, and thrift stores, or sees them as a very small (albeit valid) part of a much larger evangelism picture. Just curious...
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 03:11:04 PM Age 24, GA
I've just completed a 90 week study on the Book of Acts and NOWHERE do you see ANYONE being invited to "church"...If anything it was the total opposite; believers gathering together for edification, and commissioning, and then going out to preach the Gospel. The apostles never hung a sign outside the upper room that said "Worship Service - Upper Room 7 p.m." Now, since hardly anyone is interested in evangelism, it is the total opposite of the early church; we invite people to worship service and let the pastor "evangelize" the lost (which now the Gospel is preached as a cure to sadness/depression/self-esteem). It went from God-centered saving with fear, to man-centered sitting with apathy.
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  1. Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
    Posted On: 04/17/07 09:23:01 PMAge 35, IN
    Aside from the fact that i haven't just completed a 90 week Acts study, you took the words right out of my mouth. In Scripture, people weren't invited "to church" because the church was the BELIEVERS themselves. It was only after people became believers that they became part of the church.
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 02:56:18 PM Age 40, FL
I think it is important to witness one on one, but this artile "cheapens" and disregards the hearts of those who work diligently to do their best to present the Gospel at the events you are so much against. If the heart of the people in the event is to reach the lost, who are you to judge the methods. I have a sister and brother in law and niece who asked Jesus into thier lives at a Christmas Presentation after the Pastor's Invitation. Their lives show true conversion by the fruit of their changed lives. They were not from the area and drove 4 hours to see their family in the Christmas Pageant and had thier lives changed. They now attend a local chuch regularly, read their Bibles and do personal devotions. All because the hearts of the people in our music and drama ministry bathed the performances in prayer and were striving to present the Gospel to people in any setting possible. Are you living in today's world? Many people turn a deaf ear on one on one witnessing, but have their hearts softened by a presentation that speaks to them and prepares them to see their sin and aceepts Christ's gift of forgivenness. I once sang the song "I want Jesus in Your Heart" at an open air concert in Boston and saw a man break into tears and one of the Pastors was able to minister to him and help him turn back to his Savior after running for years. That was just the Holy Spirit using an available vessel to reach out to someone who had strayed. It was not done for my glory but for the Savior's Glory and for HIS Use! You can't "Box" the Holy Spirit's ability to work by one type of witnessing. A wise New England Preacher once reminded his congregation, "we may be the only Bible someone ever reads", so now I am reminding you. Everyone is different and different things affect people in different ways. There is one Gospel, that leads to salvation, and I will not let you tell me that there is a right or wronng way to present it. If we are availble for the Father's use, he will reach the lost through us. I will continue to pray for you and other narrow minded Christians who believe this article, and I will continue to thank God for a sister and her family who were changed by attending a Christmas Pageant that touched their hearts and brought them to Jesus.
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  1. Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
    Posted On: 04/18/07 12:54:22 AMAge 54, HI
    One of the fruit that inviting people who come to church is that they will primarily do what they have experienced. They will in turn invite others to church, because this is all they know and are comfortable with, very non-threatening way. The article is all about learning to bring the full gospel to the people anyone might want to invite to church. Being prepared to lead the lost to Christ, then invite them to your fellowship is the most impressive way to build a church.
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 02:50:37 PM Age 17, PA
THIS SOOOO TRUE !!! Unfortunately people who really need to hear it will just get offended. People are too lazy, too careless and just too absorbed in their own lives to have to think about evangelism in their day to day lives. They would MUCH rather focus on an event that they can schedule in on their calendars than be annoyed and convicted daily to witness to friends and coworkers. Why else do you think there isn't revival ? It's because we decided to dump all our personal responsibility to witness on our pastors and programs. If we want people to come to Christ then JUST TELL THEM !!! When there is an opening for you to share the gospel don't say, "you should really come to my church sometime." Instead tell them that they are sinners, tell them that they are destined to hell and then tell them what they can do about it !!!!!! THEN you can invite them to church and THEN that seed you planted will get watered !!!!
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 01:45:33 PM Age 66, WA
We would all do well to study closely the Gospel of John; keeping in mind John does not contradict the rest of Scripture. Salvation is the sovereign act, that is, the sole act and choice, of God on whom He chooses, apart from any works of man. John clearly states the only requirement for man to have eternal life in Jesus Christ is believe on Him. Paul and Peter are supportive of John in this regard in their epistles. In addition, the Scriptures clearly state our sanctification is also the sovereign work of God apart from any works of man. Paul argues this effectively in Romans and Galatians. It is most important to guard against preaching another gospel, that is a gospel of faith plus works, which is no gospel at all. We are held responsible for what God says in His Word. (Read 2 Peter and 2 Timothy) We must take what God says in His Word at face value without adding anything to it.
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  1. Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
    Posted On: 04/17/07 06:16:53 PMAge 23, CANADA
    Hey friend! Hermeneutically speaking we would have to allow the rest of scripture, not only the Gospel of John, to define what "believe on the Lord Jesus Christ" means. The unfortunate thing about many people that read the Bible and isolate scripture such as this is that they end up creating a structure of theology, doctrine and a gospel that is void of the issue of true repentance. To simply believe that Jesus is real only brings us up to the level of a demon who believes and trembles, unlike many people that have never known the fear of God but profess to "believe" in Jesus. And Im sure you would agree that we need to be careful in our Biblical studies, and that when it comes to something so foundational as the gospel that we do not play around or get lazy by seeing one verse and basing our proclamation on it. Take care!
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  2. Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
    Posted On: 04/17/07 05:01:41 PMAge 56, MN
    to the writer of GOD does the chosing for salvation here is RASBERRIES to you. GOD doesnt do the chosing for salvation, WE DO. we make the choice if we want to live with him or the devil. ANYONE know knows the character of GOD knows better than to say GOD CHOOSES who will be saved.THAT Is bologna. Christ died on the cross to give all men a CHANCE to be saved. NOW if they want to take that CHANCE and chose to be saved they will. STOP THE TWISTING OF GODS WORDS. UGH GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!
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    1. Re: Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
      Posted On: 04/17/07 10:51:59 PMAge 44, CANADA
      "raspberries to you"...how intelligent (and rude!)...just the kind of response I'd expect to see from someone so woefully ignorant of Scripture, re just who chooses who, in salvation (see John 15:16; Ephesians 1:4-11; 2 Thess. 2:13). Saving belief in Christ, is the work of God, not man (John 1:12,13, 6:29), which is granted from God (Phil. 1:29)to His elect (1 Peter 1:2). Are we "robots", as a result? No; We, the redeemed of God, joyfully come to God, AFTER our natures have been changed by God, not before (Ephesians 2:4-6). It is the "heart" that makes a man "willing" to do anything (see Exodus 35:29), including coming to Christ, by faith. The natural "heart" is unwilling (John 5:39, 40) AND unable to come to God, on his own (Romans 8:7,8, 1 Cor. 2:14). Mark also, that the "wicked" have been made by God "for Himself" (Proverbs 16:4; Romans 9:14-24). I will not say "raspberries" to the brother; only an admonition to read your Scriptures!
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    2. Re: Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
      Posted On: 04/17/07 10:24:38 PMAge 37, GA
      Is God sovereign? Yes Is God all knowing? Yes Is there anything that we must do to be saved? NO if it were yes then Christ died for no reason. Sharing our faith with others is not for our glory, but for God's. Now let's ask ourselves how God is glorified by us sharing our faith? Of course when someone comes to know Christ through our witness God is glorified because He is shown again to be sovereign and supernatural to change the eternal destiny of a person. Antoher way that he is glorified is by what I believe is the real reson that we are to be sharing our faith with other persons - Philemon verse 6. Paul writes that he prays that we will be active in sharing our faith so that we will will have a full understanding of everything that we have in Christ. It is true that God uses us (Christians) to bring people to Himself, but to think that if we do not share our faith that a person would go to hell because of it seems to smell of pride and self-righteousness. It is God who saves, NOT us. Yes we should share our faith, but not because people may spend eternity in hell (which places more importance on people) but because God deserves praise from all of His creation and we should seek His glory not ours.
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 01:24:33 PM Age 64, NE
"Comfortable" best describes so many churches, and so does lack of genuine communication and concern. It is especially sad to see the next generation learning those same "Christian" traits where there can only be surface friendships held at arm's length. But the "gospel" has been preached!! How then shall we live? How shall we conduct ourselves in our "real" life? Does what we do otherwise have anything to do with what we hear and do on Sunday morning? (I have been told "NO, it does not") Does it matter who we elect to public office? Does it matter that our children come home from school convinced that we evolved out of primal muck and slime, and have become the highest lifeform, and there is None greater? But the above questions, and so many more, have no place in such a comfortable church, where the gospel is preached. When questions like these are not discussed, the Gospel becomes little more than a history lesson about long ago people who walked around all day in their bathrobes. But the Gospel is preached! God Bless America, the land where it once was proclaimed that we are endowed by our Creator with certain inalianable rights, including life and liberty. Preaching salvation and repentence is half of it, but we also need to put that information to work. That is the other half.
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 10:44:16 AM Age 51, MI
I have walked with the Lord for over 20 years and sadden as believers we are always critical of churches that don't function the way we think they should function. If the church is a bible believing church with sound doctrine, what is wrong with reaching people in other ways. I have seen many people come to Christ in these churches and get involved. It's not totally our job to change a heart. We are part of the process in someone life. We are to plant the seed and encourage yet we are not always the one who gets to pray the prayer with them. The Holy Spirit works in different ways. What about God's timing? Someone could come to the Lord after the service. I just wish we were not such critical people. Maybe we need to take the plank out of our own eye before looking at the speck in someone elses. In Christ.
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  1. Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
    Posted On: 04/17/07 05:04:58 PMAge 56, MN
    to the author of take the PLANK out of YOUR OWN EYES. YOU need to go and buy yourself a LIFE, WALMART is selling them cheap, with that LIFE comes a brain. WAKE UP! RAY was 155% correct in his article. ITS people ASLEEP at the WHEEL like you that cant see that. PRAY FOR DISCERNMENT.
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    1. Re: Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
      Posted On: 04/17/07 06:56:36 PMAge 36, CA
      56 in MN, my stomach hurt, literally, after reading each of your comments. I cannot, in my wildest dreams imagine Jesus using sarcasm and telling someone to go to Wal Mart and get a life. When I read the comments on here that are so heavy with pride and sarcasm, the truth that may or may not be spoken is lost. Do you really think this is what God requires of you?
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 09:10:18 AM Age 46, PA
Using the authors analogy, I think his Grandfater would have been pretty upset to be awakened and told the house was on fire when there was no proof, only a belief that the house was on fire.
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 09:06:54 AM Age 65, IA
An excellent article. Easter/Istar having just passed, I read with disgust in the local papers what various "churches" were employing to bring in audiences. "egg hunts, continental breakfasts, sunrise services(hailing the rising sun), tenebrae services (right out of Roman Catholicism). The most outrageous was that of a completely apostate group (Disciples of Christ) that referred to "Holy Week". This group has A COURSE IN MIRACLES classes every Thursday and they dare to use the words "Holy Week". The liberals bring them in via social activism and acceptance of homosexual behavior.
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Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
Posted On: 04/17/07 09:00:34 AM Age 21, TN
I think the article does raise a valid point, in that we should be more active in witnessing in our daily lives. but I am not sure that it means we should not witness at events at church as well. Why not at a Christmas drama? It is the most powerful story that has ever been told about the very person that has the power to save them. Does that mean we should just say "OK good show, go home" And miss out on what could be a chance to win people to the Lord? And in response to the whole "one more stanza" deal, who are we to say God is not telling the preacher that one more person needs that last verse? To write of everything that a preacher does during the invitation as egotistical is an unfair and hasty judgement. I believe we whould witness everywhere we have the oppurtunity. Be it at church or at the supermarket
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  1. Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
    Posted On: 04/17/07 06:06:48 PMAge 23, CANADA
    Hey friend! Totally agree that we should be witnessing wherever we can. In fact the local churches that we attend are probably great places to share our faith cuz many are lost within our church buildings. I was looking at your questions and I think I can let you rest assured that the writer wasn't saying "don't share your faith at a drama production at church", or something like that, he was simply saying that we should never substitute these things as our evangelistic outreach. I can't tell you how many people I have spoken to that go to churches and they cannot tell me the gospel, which is a very frightening thing, so naturally the only thing they seem able to do is invite someone to church and let the pastor do it, cuz hes the "pro". Sadly many pastors do not preach the gospel rightly. As for the whole "1 more stanza" thing I don't see that in the article, nor anything about anyone being egotistical. His main point seems to be the unbiblical nature of todays modern "evangelism". If you haven't heard it, try listening to the sermon called "Hells Best Kept Secret" by Ray Comfort, it helps in understanding much of this. Take care!
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    1. Re: Re: Re: Quit Inviting People to Church
      Posted On: 04/17/07 09:12:27 PMAge 51, OH
      Don't forget to give them the website they will have to go to in order to hear Hell's Best Kept Secret: www.livingwaters.com Amen and Amen!
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