Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 09:07:57 AM |
Age 56, MN |
Amen, of course no one is born gay, what i mean is NO ONE in the womb was gay before they came out into this world.
WHile the author was good at stating that fact about the genes, I have heard many say that we are born in the womb with sin, that sin is in our blood.'WHich then would make the author of the gay gene correct.
that incorrect teaching has been around far longer, that what this author is now saying.
IF evangelics would take a closer look at Original sin, the way its being taught, they would line up with this man.
WE arent created gay in the womb,nor are we created with any sin of any kind in the womb.
WE BECOME SINNERS< therefore one can become gay.
BE careful not to imply as some do that we SIN because we are sinners already RIGHT out of the womb. that then makes this mans theory correct.
LETS not teach the Roman CAtholic idea of ORIGINAL sin to begin with.
YES there was the first sin, but that sin didnt make us sinners, we do, by doing oUR OWN SINS.
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Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 08:56:02 AM |
Age 38, MO |
I agree that there are not any faulty genes at work here, but I do believe that all individuals have certain weaknesses that are unique to them alone. In many cases the son of an alcoholic father will become an alcoholic himself. The son of a person who struggles with lust will often find themselves having the same struggles. There are those that are prone more to homosexual thoughts that others are, the same way that there are those who's temptation to steal is so over-powering, they feel they cannot stop themselves from pocketing items in a department store. Unfortunately, rather than believe that there is a rescue from these sinful thoughts, they chose to believe the lie that these feelings must be ok because "I cant help them". The blood of Jesus Christ can cleanse from all unrighteousness, and his grace can and WILL keep us from sinning against his word.
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Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 08:41:11 AM |
Age 38, MN |
This article is right on target. I have been watching the developments in the homosexual movement over the past several years, and it saddens me to see clergy falling into the trap of loving the sinner so much that they start making excuses for the sin. The gay community has been looking for a "gay gene" since the advent of the study of genes themselves. After that many years, it is safe to say it doesn't exist. Groups like the Family Research Institute and their SOS seminars are out there educating people on what the homosexual movement is doing to change society through it's infiltration into schools...in a few years we will be blown away by how much the movement has changed our culture unless we get involved, active and vocal right now. Yes, love the sinner. But don't make excuses for this kind of sinner - staying/living in sin will still condemn him in the end.
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Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 08:33:03 AM |
Age 16, TX |
On Albert Mohler's blog, (www.albertmohler.com/blog) he clarified this statement that was misunderstood and taken out of context. He wrote:
"1. Let's get this straight -- God's condemnation of sin is not determined by science, but by God's Word. The Bible could not be more clear -- all forms of homosexual behavior are expressly condemned as sin. In so doing the Bible uses its strongest vocabulary and places this condemnation in the larger context of the Creator's rightful expectation of our stewardship of the sexual gift. All manifestations of homosexuality are thus representations of human sinfulness and rebellion against God's express will. Nothing can alter this fact, and no discovery in science or any other human endeavor can change God's verdict.
2. There is no conclusive research that indicates any biological basis for sexual orientation. But -- and this is a big "if" here -- if science were ever to discover a correlation or causation with biological factors, Christians should not be surprised. We believe in the catastrophic and comprehensive effects of the Fall and God's judgment upon sin.
3. Such a discovery, if it were to be accepted, would not change God's condemnation of all forms of homosexual behavior, nor would it mean that this represents the inviolable "identity" of any individual. As I argued previously, moral responsibility does not require absolute moral choice. A soldier in battle may not have chosen to be in a situation of moral anguish, but he is still absolutely responsible for his decisions and actions...."
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Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 08:32:44 AM |
Age 16, TX |
On Albert Mohler's blog, (www.albertmohler.com/blog) he clarified this statement that was misunderstood and taken out of context. He wrote:
"1. Let's get this straight -- God's condemnation of sin is not determined by science, but by God's Word. The Bible could not be more clear -- all forms of homosexual behavior are expressly condemned as sin. In so doing the Bible uses its strongest vocabulary and places this condemnation in the larger context of the Creator's rightful expectation of our stewardship of the sexual gift. All manifestations of homosexuality are thus representations of human sinfulness and rebellion against God's express will. Nothing can alter this fact, and no discovery in science or any other human endeavor can change God's verdict.
2. There is no conclusive research that indicates any biological basis for sexual orientation. But -- and this is a big "if" here -- if science were ever to discover a correlation or causation with biological factors, Christians should not be surprised. We believe in the catastrophic and comprehensive effects of the Fall and God's judgment upon sin.
3. Such a discovery, if it were to be accepted, would not change God's condemnation of all forms of homosexual behavior, nor would it mean that this represents the inviolable "identity" of any individual. As I argued previously, moral responsibility does not require absolute moral choice. A soldier in battle may not have chosen to be in a situation of moral anguish, but he is still absolutely responsible for his decisions and actions...."
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Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 08:16:54 AM |
Age 45, MO |
"A premil/pretrib "Left Behind"-gene?"
As I read down through the list of sins and foibles that the author included with the "gay gene" I was taken aback when I got to the "sin" of being a "premil/pretrib" person. While I would never defend Tim LaHaye and his books, I do find it odd that Steve Camp includes those who are pre-trib/pre-mil with adulterers, thieves and liars. I don't know who Camp is but I gather he is not Pre-trib. Perhaps he is a Preterist. There's a lot of that going around these days. Whatever his views it is telling that he would include Pre-trib people in his list.
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Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 07:53:05 AM |
Age 52, IN |
Excellent. My hope is that Christian leaders learn to humble themselves, admit their mistakes and ask forgiveness, when appropriate. Why is it so hard for people to say "I was wrong, please forgive me."? ... Perhaps it is the great deciever, convincing us that we are not ever really wrong, just 'misunderstood' -- giving us the hope that we can just explain-away all of our mistakes. This is of course, a lie. The truth is that holding eachother accountable is vitally important, so I say "Thank you." for delightfully suggesting that this should be resolved in a manner that would give the followers in his church a godly example of how to admit a mistake and resolve this in a truly Christian manner. We are called to do no less. Keep up the great work. Suzy B.
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Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 07:46:41 AM |
Age 35, OH |
" Question: how do you tell a gay sheep from a straight sheep?"
Answer: Elementary, dear Watson. The straight sheep have sex with sheep of the opposite sex. The gay sheep have sex with sheep of the same sex.
Or, as this Seattle times article (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2002340883_gayscience19m.html) says,
"These animals consistently ignore females and bestow all their amorous attentions on members of their own sex."
This may not translate over to do human homosexuality, but I thought I'd answer one of your questions.
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Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 07:46:13 AM |
Age 51, KY |
While I appreciate and respect Dr. Mohler, I find this trend to be disturbing. As Christian first and Southern Baptist second I am perplexed as to why we are looking for a scientific reason for sin? This is ludicrous. This is starting down the path that Isaiah warned about in Isaiah 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
Dietrich Bonhoeffer alluded to the fact that even in his time that the trend had moved from God's justification of sin for man to man justifying his own sin without God.
I realize that Dr Mohler is not excusing the sin or accepting it, however things like this are the first steps toward acceptance.
As it was quoted that Laura Ingram had made the statement, "Just shut up and preach!" This is what we get when pastors and church leader beging speaking out of school and begin to use other than the Bible for the basis of their discerment. 1st Corinthians 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
Let our ministers stay on course with the Word and stop trying to be genetecists, biologists, astronomers and be preachers of the word. Get out of the text books and back to the Bible!!! Christians are called to be witnesses no matter what their occupation. We are not all called to be all occupations. I have seen too many pastors that try to show expertise in other fields than the Bible and it always seems to be a distraction or in this case an embarrassment.
These scientific issues are important, however, let's let the scientists do their jobs. Take a hint from Ken Hamm at Answers in Genesis. Ken does not go to seminaries to find researchers for Creationsism, he looks for "Actual Scientists" to do the research. Why does he do this? To create credibility. When Dr Jason Lilse speaks on Astronomy and Cosmological theories, it has credibility because he is a trained and recognized Astronomer.
Yes, pastor's can quote sources and they can speak on various subjects but this is a case where a pastor is speaking contrary to not only the Bible but to scientific fact.
Dr Mohler, sir if you read this, I would urge you to do be more careful research and to please just preach the word. I know that being in the position that you are, you have a great many responsibilities. This is not the example that I think that your are wanting to set for your students at SBTS. You are in my prayers.
Jeff Ramey
FLorence KY
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- Re: Re: Whatever Happened to Sin? ...One Christian Leader Suggests: it Could be in
| Posted On: 03/20/07 08:34:04 PM | | Age 34, MO |
Hi. Interesting response. Did you actually read either of Mohler's articles, or merely respond off the cuff?
Btw, I believe Mohler is being a witness here in season and out of season, preaching the word in a secular context. Please remember this is the future. Thanks.
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al mohler's 'gay gene' statements and your article on it...
| Posted On: 03/20/07 07:45:36 AM |
Age 44, FL |
yes.
i would like to say that i do not see any contradiction in what mr. mohler said in his initial article and what he said in his 'rebuttal'. He was clearly hypothesizing and saying that the issue SHOULD NOT BE whether there IS a gay gene or not. EITHER WAY homosexual activity is a sin. period.
It makes me sad to see you so desperate for 'news' that you are making a bigger deal out of this YOURSELF and not getting on to the GOSPEL yourself.
Just an observation that seems dominant among these 'newsy' sites.
Blessings overall...
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