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Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/19/07 09:52:48 AM Age 42, TN
One solution to this could be family bible studies. There is a great series being done by "In His Heart and Hand Ministries," written by Mary Bironas. I've sat in classes of 35 to 75 people who came as families and interacted and studied together. The age range was about 8 yrs old to 62 yrs old. It works.
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  1. Re: Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 07/28/07 10:40:23 PMAge 39, WI
    Could I please have information regarding the family bible study stated in "age 42, TN". I've "googled" it and nothing came up regarding this bible study. Any contact information would be helpful. "In His Heart and Hand Ministries" by Mary Bironas. Thank You, Age 39, WI
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/19/07 09:03:27 AM Age 43, MD
I believe that the organization called the church is at fault. Our church promotes busyness for the parents...you MUST meet for smallgroup, women's Bible study, men's Bible study, segregated Sunday Schools etcetera. WHEN do we have TIME to actually spend with our families? My son once observed to me sarcastically "why don't we call the deacons?" when I was having trouble and my husband (a deacon busy at church) was not there for me. I am a woman, and my opinion does not matter in our denomination. My husband also works 14 hour days. I am like a single parent, stressing and burning out as I try to homeschool my kids and raise them properly with not enough support. What can I do?
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  1. Re: Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 04/05/07 02:49:21 AMAge 53, IA
    It sounds alot like my church... There is another problem as well. If churches are keeping people so busy with so many groups and activities, when do they get the time to do the research to see if what they're being taught is the truth? You wouldn't believe the amount of time it can take (even with internet access).
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  2. Re: Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 03/21/07 05:15:17 PMAge 45, AZ
    Amen dear....I totally agree with you. I do not believe God honors all of this busyness at the expense of the family unit. I believe satan has been able to convince the church that busyness is of God. If only they could see that most of it is the works of their own hands. And works of iniquity to build their monument to themselves....not to glorify God. And the children see it and run when they are old enough to make their own decisions. Who can blame them? It may be better that they stay out of church awhile to build a strong personal relationship with the Lord. I haven't found a church yet that remotely resembles the ones formed in ACTS.
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  3. Re: Call the Deacons Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 03/19/07 02:27:41 PMAge 53, OH
    Personally - I agree with your son. It's time to call the Deacons. Let the Elders (Grandma and Grandpa) do the church busy work - Hire the craftsmen and women who do the work from your congregations and leave the family to do family at least 4 nights a week. So what if your pastor has to put up with a building that isn't a showplace. Yes, the kids need time to be kids and the parents need a night to themselves. Having been a deacon when my children were young teens I am GLAD to have been fired when my daughter argued with the youth pastor over a Scripture issue. She took the side I taught her and used some backup she must have found for herself because I had to look up what she said to make sure of it myself before I met with the elders. I still think she was right and he was wrong and the elders never did convince me. It took several years for my wife and I to find a healing church (even stronger than the old church on ("Is it Written?") and my daughter is still working out issues of authority. Get together with your husband now or regret it later. The church family means nothing if your family is falling apart. I'm a Deacon and a Grandpa and the family all talks and we have a good relationship. We don't always agree but we do know how to comunicate.
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/18/07 07:12:20 PM Age 58, MN
As a former youth pastor and homeschooling father of 9 (with 3 still at home),it was refreshing to hear someone say the things I was saying 25 years ago. We sacrificed the prospect for a high paying job by leaving the city for a small town/rural community and church life that didn't pull our children in every which way but towards us. We have never regretted that decision and have seen the fruit in the lives of our children. Even so, some have made poor choices along the way. They like to point out that THEY were responsible for those decisions, not their parents, but my one regret is that, as I trained them how to get my direction and give me their obedience, I failed to direct them to seek the Lord with their own hearts. No matter where you live or what your church or circumstances, without modeling a heart of love that wants to please the Lord above all else, we can achieve outward obedience while at home and still lose them to the world's ways and attractions when they decide to leave. "Give me your heart, my son." Prov. 23:26
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/18/07 08:58:22 AM Age 41, CA
What about commuting families? Families like mine whose husbands are gone 13-14 hours a day? It is so easy for others, especially those living in other states, to make very casual comments about "finding another job." We are barely making ends meet, and if my husband were to find a job in our area he would lose so much salary that we would lose our house. If we were to move closer to his work house prices go up by the hundreds of thousands. Where we live in So. CA a cheap area of homes are $500,000. I am grateful for the mentors we have in our church; the adults that assist me in the godly raising of my children. If it weren't for them, I would be doing this completely alone. I can only do so much! I am only one person.
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  1. Re: Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 03/19/07 01:05:18 PMAge 54, AR
    I think we can safely assume that the author was not talking about true spiritual help and nurturing from the family of God. That is essential. And it sounds like you truly are blessed by such. But the wholesale giving over of your children to program after program seems almost pagan.You'll find none of that practiced by our ancestors. We have become glorified babysitters, with children, youth and families exhausted from all the activity. When do we "be still and know"? We drop our kids off at the front door and don't see them again until it's over. The truth is, as I see it, we are more self-centered than God centered and don't want to be disturbed at church on Sundays by our children. We want a babysitter.And fool ourselves with the notion that our kids are learning to know Christ when in fact statistics say otherwise. When our love of self truly dies and knowing Christ and Him alone becomes formost, things will then and only then radically change. First within us then passed to our children by example and their own true experience with Christ and dying to self.
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  2. Re: Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 03/19/07 11:57:51 AMAge 43, WI
    Hi, I was a single mom for 4 years. My kids love family Bible time. We cuddle on the couch. sing some hymns together from a hymnal, then read a chapter or two from the Bible. discussing what God is teaching as we go. Then we get on our knees and pray for lots of people and a good night sleep and it is off to bed. I can't tell you how wonderful it is. God placed you over the children He gave you, you are the one responsible before God for how those children of His are raised. Don't be blaming your situation. You have a Bible, read it and enjoy. Sing praises to your creator too. Honestly maybe it doesn't sound like a "fun" program at church, but there is nothing more loving and blessed than family Bible time at home. My children run for the couch when i say it is Bible time. Blessings to you,
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  3. Re: Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 03/19/07 11:45:04 AMAge 53, PA
    Many Biblical teachings command us as parents that raising our children in the fear of the Lord is mandated by God and the direct responsibility of the parents, not the "whole village ", the church, or any members of the church. As parents of true Christian faith, what is our ultimate goal? What is the most important thing in our life? Unwillingness to experience a salary cut? or loosing our earthly possesions? or directly and responsibly raising our children in the fear of the Lord? This is the land of opportunities and choices. Any choice we make has consequences. By the way, "the whole village" has many non-truebelievers,pedofiles, rapists, adulters,..... The church is like a Noah Ark which can contain a lot of filth, sick people, and sheep in wolf's skin,...
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  4. Re: Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 03/19/07 11:30:54 AMAge 24, WA
    I don't think the author was attacking a certain work ethic or lifestyle, he was pointing out our responsibility in giving our children biblical training. My husband is full-time military and is gone for months at a time. He is leaving for 18 months in a week. The point is not how much time you spend together, the point is using the time you have to uphold biblical teaching and family worship. We have the tendency to expect the church to do that for us. We need to take responsibility first, and let the church be our encouragement, our supplemental resource, not our main one.
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  5. Re: Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 03/18/07 01:44:45 PMAge 48, NC
    I have twelve children, aged 4 to 28. When my husband and I had our first four children, he was getting his painting company going and would work long hours. Several nights a week, I was putting the children to bed by myself. I prayed with the kids and taught them scripture as part of their homeschool. My husband was soon convicted by the Holy Spirit to be home with his kids at night and to let God grow his business. He taught the kids the Bible and what it is to walk with God. We both found that the key isn't to be a "Sunday School teacher" at home, teaching "lessons" and memorizing Bible verses, but rather, teaching the children to FOLLOW God themselves. Whether you send your kids to Sunday School (we didn't) or only teach them yourself, the Christian life cannot be boiled down to a program. It has to have Life! We study the Bible alone and together to find out what God is saying to us---not to teach a "lesson". We prayed with our children and for them. Some nights, my husband would go into their rooms and lay hands on the kids, praying for guidance for each one. My husband was great about teaching our kids and teens along the lines of Deuteronomy 6, ALWAYS talking to them about Jesus and what life is all about---in the car, at the dinner table, on the way to bed, going to work--everywhere! We talk openly about , , temptation, bullies, cliques, love, hate, birth, , everything. And it has worked. My kids all know and want to know God better all the time. Their hearts are completely His---and I am so grateful! My husband died last year at 49 years old. I still have five kids to raise. So, once again, I am doing it alone. But, God is more than faithful. He has sustained all of us with a very strong sense of His Presence and Love. You can do it, even when you're "only one person" because "greater is He that is in you, than he that is in the world". God will give you the guidance and the strength you need as long as you are setting the example and seeking Him with all of your heart yourself! God bless you.
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/17/07 10:11:49 PM Age 39, AL
AMEN!
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/17/07 07:43:27 PM Age 61, MD
Thank you for this article. It needs to be said. As I am in the "over 60" group, I have observed and been involved in youth ministries over the years. I don't see "youth ministry" per se in scripture. I see families. God placed us in families - the older teaching the younger - The Titus 2 principle, for sure. Do we want our children coming to us, confiding in us, or to the youth minister? Do we want our children following their peers or godly parents? Overarching all of this is: Parents have the responsibility before God to raise up their children in the nuture and admonition of the Lord. May God help us parents and grandparents to do what God has called us to do - pray and work (by God's grace and His power) for the night is coming.
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/17/07 05:57:50 PM Age 51, MN
The article fails to take into acount divided households. What happens when one parent is trying to disciple the children but the other parent is apathetic and uninvolved?
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/17/07 03:29:07 PM Age 56, NY
Good article, but I'd go further with it. What ever reason is there for a youth pastor in the beginning when in a Chriatian home there are 2 already there and several more in the extended family and friends. Like he said, why pay someone for part-time questionable work when you can do it better and cheaper yourself - more satisfying too. Our 3 in college, teaching Sunday school, in Bible study groups, considering the mission field for careers. We weren't perfect parents but had help from family and friends, had no TV in the home, played games at night, applied scriptures to daily issues. Parents have been raising good kids for generations, it is not rocket science if you stay traditional, (and scriptural)!
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  1. Re: Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
    Posted On: 03/18/07 06:46:55 PMAge 51, MX
    Great article and about time...opened my eyes to my failure as a parent as to my responsibility, no matter how "busy" i am...gives me incentive to go for it, possibly organizing families of the Chrisitan friends of my daughters to have us all meet together (teenagers and parents alike) for worship, the Word, and fun together!!! Thank you!
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/17/07 03:19:14 PM Age 51, AR
As a father of four and a youth pastor, I've been on both sides of the issue. Unfortunately, every poll of so-called born-again American Christians reveals that most think and act like heathen. As William Wilberforce would say, most Americans are merely cultural Christians. This changes the debate. A heathen will likely raise his kids with just enough religion to damn them to hell. (Excuse my hate speach.) To say it's better for a cow to be milked with human hands doesn't mean that milk derived another way is not also beneficial. And that's not a Mooooot point.
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Re: Don't Give Spiritual Custody of Your Children to The Church
Posted On: 03/17/07 12:39:49 PM Age 41, NY
amen and amen! we must not forget that 'our enemy prowls around, seeking whom he may devour'. Jesus warned us to be sober and alert at all times... and that our enemies would be WITHIN our own household! the 'church' today, when run the world's way instead of God's way, IS the enemy's effective tool for deceiving us, dividing families, and luring us into complacency. let all those with 'eyes to see and ears to hear' the Great Shepherd help others to see it too. praise the Lord, who CAN and WILL turn the hearts of fathers back to their families, as it should be. shame on 'churches' who are the 'servants of satan' who take the parents out of their homes to 'serve' in church, and who take the children away from the parents to 'indoctrinate them' and usurp the authority of the parents. for those of us with children still at home - it is never too late to make a decision to do things God's way... He is good and will redeem our mistakes as we obey and move forward. thank you, Jesus!
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